Discuss Lost 1/21/09 *Spoilers* About This Page:

[Shell_of_the_South]

So, what did you think? I thought it was a little slow. It was interesting to see Dr. Marvin Candle - and to learn that's not his real name. That lends evidence to the fact that Dharma may not have been on the up and up. Fun to see Daniel in the Dharma station.

Looks like Charlotte has the sickness from time travel, but why is she the only one?

Wonder who is behind the court order for Kate and Aaron's blood samples?

Sawyer made me sad when he said he jumped so "she" could go home, then corrected it to "they".

But the big question - did Hurley make the right decision not to trust Ben? And who is Ben taking orders from? She was the woman who Desmond saw in his time travels/flashbacks. And who is Jill - the woman Ben talked to in the store?

These episodes opened up lots of cans of worms!

[Shell_of_the_South]

Here's another question - Daniel told Desmond to find his mother. Is his mother the white haired woman that Ben reported to, the same woman Desmond met before?

Oh, and another thought - wasn't the whole Ana Lucia thing weird? Especially the last comment, Libby says hi. The whole scene just didn't seem to fit.

[HiddenMickey]

The kids and I watched last night (school delayed two hours, so I let them stay up). The kids said it bothers them that there is so much jumping around. Too hard to keep anything straight.

Fun show though. Lots and lots to think about.

Poor Hurley. To choose jail over going with Ben? I sure hope someone can get him out of there.

Why did Sun call Kate and have her meet with her? There didn't seem to be a reason. Is she trying to get back to the Island too? or did it have to do with trying to kill Ben or what?

And where was Kate going to go when she left with so little with her?

And who were the guys who tried to kill Sayid? And why did Hurley have to pick up the gun?

We came up with an old question that we couldn't remember the answer to...
Who was it that shot Ana Lucia and Libby? Oh, just remembered.....Michael! OK then. Sorry to get off topic.

New bad guys on the island (they must be before Dharma?) trying to cut off Juliet's hand! Yikes. Those are the baddest guys yet, I think. Were they also the ones with the flaming arrows or are there other bad guys?

Can't wait for some answers (and more questions) next week!

[korki-rad]

Oooh! I loved this one! I loved that it started out with the Dharma guy! They are definitely *not* on the up and up! Since I think that Ben and Widmore have been time traveling for centuries (I suspect that they are somehow connected to the very old boat they found...maybe Widmore was the captain and Ben a crew member)...maybe Widmore was behind Dharma and using it as a front to do research on the island?

I also believe Hurley is the key to the whole show...that if he follows his morals and instincts, things will end up okay. But not sure he should have confessed to three murders.

I guessed that it was Sun who called Kate. I'm not sure she had a motive, but just was in LA and is still friendly with Kate. She may have wanted to tell Kate about Widmore, but maybe not. Probably just a convenient twist to push the Oceanic 6 together in the storyline....but maybe there are others pulling the strings, too.

I don't think Kate knew where she was going...that's why she was just about to call Jack when Sun called her. I think she was sitting in the car, contemplating her options when the call came through. (Remember, Aaron told her he was tired of driving and wanted to go home....I think she was just getting away from the house and didn't know where to go.) She stashed a lot of cash and probably figured she could buy anything they really needed.

I assumed the guys trying to kill Sayid were from the "list" of people he had been assassinating. Are they supposed to be Widmore's guys? But, I also thought that they could be people working for Ben...forcing Sayid to search out either Ben or Jack, and thus, head back to the island. It just seems like something Ben would do. BTW...that one with the knives in the dishwasher was too much! Ugh!

Any why did Hurley have to pick up the gun? Why oh why! Just Hurley's bad luck, I suppose.

By the way -- I am really starting to like Daniel Faraday. My jaw just dropped when he showed up in the scene with them drilling in the Orchid station!

I am really curious about the lady in the butcher shop. Have we seen her before? She looked kinda familiar, but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. I was thinking that maybe she was the person in charge of security on the island, but I might have that wrong. And I thought she was killed, but you know how *that* goes.....

I had gotten the idea last season that maybe Charlotte and Daniel have been time traveling already -- this ep confirmed that Daniel has. So maybe Charlotte has, too. Or maybe her research has gotten her too close to radiation...didn't Desmond get a bloody nose right before he made his phone call to Penny on the freighter?

I think Ben was behind the court order for the blood samples...he knew it would force Kate to take Aaron and run...maybe hoped that she would go to Jack, and then, be more open to going back to the island.

The big question I had is why don't they run into themselves when they jump in time on the island...if they jump to a time when their camp is there, won't they run into themselves in the past (ala Back to the Future)? Or do you think that could be the mysterious "ghosts" that we see at times?

And how is Locke dead, but not dead?

And the Anna Lucia thing.....hmmmmmmmmmmmm? Makes me think everyone who is dead, maybe isn't -- like they are sitting in some big purgatory somewhere, coming back to help every now and again. Maybe it has something to do with the island's jumping in time...maybe the dead ones can flash back and give warnings if the island jumps to a time when they were alive?

It makes my brain swim!! And I like it!!

Never enough answers though, and always more questions...............................

[Shell_of_the_South]

Originally Posted by korki-rad

Since I think that Ben and Widmore have been time traveling for centuries (I suspect that they are somehow connected to the very old boat they found...maybe Widmore was the captain and Ben a crew member

Wow - hadn't thought of that - very interesting thought!

[bitterchickey]

OK now, what was that thing LOCKE was sitting against after Richard fixed his leg??? Looked like a big head to me (ala the 4 toe statue?).
Sun, I believe is hatin on Jack and I think HE is really the second person she holds responsible for Jin's death.
White hair lady (has a name-can't remember it) is the one who sold Desmond the ring (last season, one before?) and producers have said that SHE will be the KEY to unravelling the secrets.
Jill, I believe has been seen with Ben's gang, maybe she was the one in charge when they "tried" Juliet?
Thinking Ben was behind the assassins at the safe house, to push Sayid back to him, but thinking the guy who was the orderly (with locke) and visited Hurley in the asylum (can't remember his name either now!), maybe he and his cohorts (whomever they may be) are behind the "court order" on the blood work. And hello?? Since when do lawyers show up to take dna at your house? Glad she saw it for a scam!
2nd big Q of the night: Why won't Richard know Locke next time they meet? Does the time warping island effect Richard or not?
The new bad guys did have Dharma logos on their jumpsuits, didn't they? And English accents (like the white haired lady...).
Now to Charlotte...
Desmond got the nosebleed, but was saved by his "constant", speaking to Penny.
George wasn't so lucky...got the nosebleed, then seized in the radio room and died.
Daniel has a constant (desmond), Charlotte obviously does not. But then, neither does Miles. My first thought is that they all travelled to and from the island by zodiac &/or helicopter (which is what George did) but so did Sawyer (partly). The other survivors have only been on the island, and have not travelled to and fro. Will we see the symptoms in Sawyer and Miles? But if Charlotte was born on the island (as hinted to by Miles) does that make her more susceptible?

[christiejay]

I thought these two episodes were really good. They didn't answer any questions really, but certainly got the ball rolling.

I was wondering if the woman from the store when Desmond was time-shifting (the one at the end that Ben reports to) is Daniel's mother. When he asked Desmond to go find his mother you never did hear what her name was. So at the end when she was making all those calculations, I thought maybe that was her, until I saw that it was Ben walking in instead of Desmond. I will be interested to see how she and the meat shop woman play into this season's storylines.

Something I've been wondering about ... didn't Penny get from her home to the crash site awfully quick? I mean, it seems like Desmond had just called her from the freighter before they ended up adrift in the ocean when the island disappeared. Then her boat shows up out of nowhere.

Poor Hurley. First he said he would never help Sayid but then he did. And then he did exactly what Sayid told him to do (opposite of whatever Ben asks) and it gets him in trouble. Couldn't you just see it in Sayid's eyes when he realized Jack had sent Ben to Hurley, that Sayid knew they would lose Hurley.

I want to see more of Daniel with Dharma. And when in time are they now? Are they way before Dharma - or were these bad guys the original Dharma people or like an advance team for Dharma? They called it their island, but I don't think they are Richard's people. Perhaps they are connected with Widmore.

Why won't Richard recognize Locke the next time they see each other? I thought Richard was immune to all this time-traveling stuff and would know everything. That was so cool how he showed up at just the right time and place to help Locke. Loved Locke's and Richard's lines here - What is it? A compass, John. What does it do? It points North, John.

Why is the island shifting so frequently? Once Ben turned that wheel, is the island now so unstuck that it can't get itself settled into one particular time? I always thought it was just going to be moved once and then it would be a one-time thing to find it again. This constant movement is going to make things much more challenging than I had originally thought it would be.

Remember Charlotte saying something about searching for her mother, and seemed intrigued by the Dharma symbol on the polar bears' collar like maybe she recognized it. Then Miles had said something about maybe she had been there before (?) I can't remember his exact words from that episode ... Perhaps she has been time travelling before but doesn't realize it. Maybe she is getting sick because she doesn't have a constant? But then who would everybody else's constanta be since they're not getting sick? Maybe she's just been travelling too much previously and she is being affected sooner than everybody else.

I wonder why Sun was in LA. Surely not just to see Kate, she could have contacted Kate at any time if all she wanted to do was talk.

6 more days until another episode!!!

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by Shell_of_the_South

So, what did you think? I thought it was a little slow. It was interesting to see Dr. Marvin Candle - and to learn that's not his real name. That lends evidence to the fact that Dharma may not have been on the up and up. Fun to see Daniel in the Dharma station.

Looks like Charlotte has the sickness from time travel, but why is she the only one?

Wonder who is behind the court order for Kate and Aaron's blood samples?

Sawyer made me sad when he said he jumped so "she" could go home, then corrected it to "they".

But the big question - did Hurley make the right decision not to trust Ben? And who is Ben taking orders from? She was the woman who Desmond saw in his time travels/flashbacks. And who is Jill - the woman Ben talked to in the store?

These episodes opened up lots of cans of worms!

I only have a few minutes to check email before my after school clients show up, and YOU just blew my mind with those questions.

This is a great discussion! I am SO happy to have this place where I can find other Losties. If I even asked those questions amoung my "realtime" peeps, they'd be looking at me funny and suggesting I get a real life.

[christiejay]

The lady in charge of Juliet's trial was older, she reminded me a lot of the woman who Desmond saw in his flash and who Ben reported to at the end. {Boy we have got to get a name for this woman!} But Jill might have been an "Other" who Ben has assigned to this position ... or maybe just an off-island contact that he had previously made.

The new baddies had logos that I thought were similar to Dharma, but not exactly the same. Unless of course they were a previous incarnation of Dharma.

Maybe Richard won't recognize Locke because they are going so far back in time in the next shift that it is before he first met Locke as a young boy?

[SarahJ]

Lots of good questions & theories.

My theory on Charlotte is that she and Daniel are somehow related but only he knows that. He seems to have a connection with her and a need to protect her. Perhaps they are brother and sister, thus the need to find his mother who could be Charlotte's constant. Or even weirder is that Charlotte could actually be Daniel's mother then he would be her constant. Hmmm....... Kind of far fetched, but then isn't the whole show.

[korki-rad]

Originally Posted by SarahJ

Lots of good questions & theories.

My theory on Charlotte is that she and Daniel are somehow related but only he knows that. He seems to have a connection with her and a need to protect her. Perhaps they are brother and sister, thus the need to find his mother who could be Charlotte's constant. Or even weirder is that Charlotte could actually be Daniel's mother then he would be her constant. Hmmm....... Kind of far fetched, but then isn't the whole show.

I don't know that it's so far-fetched...I've had thoughts that maybe the hostiles/natives were actually the offspring of the Losties, who perhaps ended up living in a time BEFORE the plane actually crashed on the island...when you start dealing with time travel, anything is possible!!

Along the ideas of constants...maybe the people on the plane are all each other's constants...everyone's story line intersects at various points. Maybe that's why?

I love Lost!

[christiejay]

Charlotte definitely has some sort of connection to the island. What that is, I don't know. When we find out it will probably be some mind-blowing thing that will be one of the central issues of the whole show!

[Caldercup]

Apparently, Dr. Chang (Candle/Wickmund /Halliwax) was revealed to officially be "Chang" in a special presentation done by the Lost producers at ComiCon. (Some are speculating that it looks as if Farraday was the one behind the camera for the filming of the ComicCon video and was the guy -- in disguise -- filming the "Arrow Station" video they were about to do. Another cool thing is that people are commenting that Chang's baby *could* be Myles. Also, there was a redheaded child in the background as Chang was walking to the studio and it's possible that this could be Charlotte. (All total guesses, but cool nonetheless.) Didja notice that Chang still had both hands?!

The guy in the woods who threatened to chop off Juliet's hand? I think that might be Penny's evil dad as a much younger man. And he's the one who chopped off Chang's hand. (In the ComiCon video, Chang looks at his hand longingly, as if he knows it will be gone in the future.)

"that's not his real name. That lends evidence to the fact that Dharma may not have been on the up and up."

I think it's more a matter of Dharma not wanting the "left hand to know what the right hand was doing." Remember, all of the people in the stations had no idea of the barracks and the rest of the D.I. They were intentionally left in the dark and being tricked as part of their various "experiments."

"Looks like Charlotte has the sickness from time travel, but why is she the only one?"

The sickness affects different people differently. But it also has to do with how close they come to being near where they were in a previous "past." This lends credence to the idea that she's been on the island before.

"Wonder who is behind the court order for Kate and Aaron's blood samples?"

I think this is Ben's doing -- in order to get Kate willing to move and get anywhere that she can't lose Aaron... in other words, go to the island. It's also possible that this is Sun's doing.... (She was being very "tricksy" in that conversation and I'm not sure I trust her anymore.)

"who is Ben taking orders from? She was the woman who Desmond saw in his time travels/flashbacks."

I'm guessing that Mrs. Hawking (the white-haired lady) is Daniel's mom. She's the one who Desmond dealt with that time he became "unstuck" in time. There's some interesting info on her: "On the Season 3 DVD, Damon Lindelof describes Hawking as "some sort of temporal policeman in place to make sure that everybody who is supposed to get to the island, does." He says this is related to the grand scale of Fate versus free will." (From Lostpedia's article on Mrs. Hawking.)

And who were the guys who tried to kill Sayid? And why did Hurley have to pick up the gun?

They weren't trying to *kill* Sayid or they would've used bullets, not tranquilizers or, as some are speculating, the same poisoned spider that paralyzed Paulo and Nikki from a few seasons ago -- that's why some think they had Hurley's father watching Nikki's TV show -- Exposé. (Some are also speculating that Locke isn't dead, but paralyzed to appear dead and "gather" the Losties.

"I am really curious about the lady in the butcher shop. Have we seen her before?"

According to Lostpedia, we've not seen her or heard her name ("Jill" or the names she and Ben discuss) before. I think the two guys they talk about are the two guys that show up at Kate's house for the DNA sample -- as a ruse to scare her into contacting Jack.

As to "why don't the Losties run into themselves?" It's possible that they just haven't run into themselves yet, but I'm thinking that the whispers are actually what happens when time traveling people run into themselves in the same "time."

"The new bad guys did have Dharma logos on their jumpsuits, didn't they? And English accents (like the white haired lady...)."

No, they were military outfits -- and people have placed them and their guns to being in the 50's or 60's. I personally think they might be part of the "listening station" that discovered and transmitted The Numbers a long time ago.


I've been reading tons on Lostpedia and enjoying myself hugely. I cannot wait to watch it again!
Eileen

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by Shell_of_the_South

Looks like Charlotte has the sickness from time travel, but why is she the only one?

Sawyer made me sad when he said he jumped so "she" could go home, then corrected it to "they".

These episodes opened up lots of cans of worms!

Great questions! I think different people have different abilities to weather the time travel. Desmond, they said, is very special. That may be because he was able to create a "constant", which seems to be key in some ways. Phillip K Dick's Valis Trilogy goes into some of the theory that the lost writers used to build the story line.

Sawyer was a little slap happy this episode, I thought. Hitting is not attractive! HE needs to spend some time in time out and think about better behavior!

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by Shell_of_the_South

Oh, and another thought - wasn't the whole Ana Lucia thing weird? Especially the last comment, Libby says hi. The whole scene just didn't seem to fit.

Well, they both died on the island. Seems like anyone who dies on the island does not stay dead. Also Claire and Jack's father came back to life!